[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Hi all.
Thanks for all the recommendations and advice. I have already solved everything and can confirm that the 80cc engine with compression can be spinned with start shoes in rear clutch.
Maybey somebady will have same issue so here are reulsts of my tests.
In my case it wast two parts.
First slipped start shoes, than slipped drive belt on Malossi Multivar.

In my case start shoes slipping was all about rubber compound. New start shoes Malossi and Ferodo with soft rubber which should improve friction and makes starts eaisier both slipped. So I tested very old original start shoes with very hard rubber and it worked. So I bought brand new original Piaggio start shoes. Rubber is harder than Malossi and Ferodo and they works best without slipping.

Drive belt slipping on Malossi Multivar is about buslenght (there are meny other topics about this issue). I did not modified buslenght, but tested several AVX13 driven belt commonly used in cars and try to find the widest one.
Recommended GATES 6468MC slipped in my case. BOSCH 1 987 947 503 was littel bit better. The best one in my case is MEYLE 052 013 0950. This driven belt is not slipping on my Multivar.
Regards
D.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

I had the same issue with my start clutch and 80cc engine. Compression was too high and start shoes slipped. I needed to improve friction of start shoes. In my case it was all about start shoes rubber compound. New start shoes Malossi and Ferodo with soft rubber which should improve friction and makes starts eaisier both slipped. So I tested very old original start shoes with very hard rubber and it worked. So I bought brand new original Piaggio start shoes. Rubber is harder than Malossi and Ferodo and they works best without slipping.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Hello
You can try what I did.
First take off side panel and easy see what is going on.
You can see if slips drive belt or start shoes. Push the pedal and check if you feel fricton and resistence of the start shoes. If ou feel friction, bell turns but clutch not there is problem with start shoes. Or you can see that clutch turns but drive belt slips on clutch or variator.

Than you can try basic service of drivetrain.
Take clutch bell out of the clutch and start shoes out of the bell. Check rubbers on start shoes, if neccesery degrease them and brush with sand paper. Degrease well also oposite part on clutch body.
Take of drive belt and check its condition, mabey easiest is to replace drive belt with the new one. Check pulleys on clutch and variator, its surface and degrease them. Mount it all back and set drive belt tension. Test it again.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Hi FonS
Thank you for your experiences and recommendation. It is very useful for me, I will test Gates drive belt. I have one question for you regarding the Multivar – are you using Multivar with original buslength or have you shortened it?

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Hello Wim, Thank you.
Do you use it? Do you know if this belt will work on Multivar? There are several belts on the market 13×950-965 but I will really appreciate some already tested recommendation of belt.
Also SIP has some belt https://www.sip-scootershop.com/cs/product/remen-pro-pohon-vario_92380000?q=Pohon
There is Polini belt for vario 965×12,3mm 32°
And also some new MCBELT https://www.scooter-center.com/en/v-belt-mc-belt-955-piaggio-ciao-converter-v-belt-mc0955?number=MC0955
Or industrial belt 13mm GATES 6468MC

There are so many choices.
Multivar is often used variaotar so there must be users with experiences.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Hello
I made test with different start shoes over the weekend.
It is all about rubber compound. New shoes with softer rubber are slipping on clutch in my case, although they should provide better grip and eliminate slipping. I had best results with pair of old original start shoes with very hard rubber compound. I have almost non slipping on clutch with these old start shoes.

But when I solved this issue, I had new one.
As meny of you asked me, my belt is now slipping on multivar.
So now I am testing belts.
Actualy I have only my Bosch belt which does not heve suitabe dimensions. Do not know angle, I can mesure only dimensions (althought outer width 13mm, inner width is only 7,3mm and thickness 8,8mm)
I would like to use original Malossi belt but they produce only lenght 978mm which seems to be too long for Multivar with rear 90mm pulley.

Can somebody recomend to me which belt works correctly with multivar and 90mm rear pulley? Lenght should by about 955mm. This will help me a lot. Thank you.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Yes Wim, pullstart can be solution 😀
But I need to keep functional bycicle mode. I think pullstart gets in the way of crankarms.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Hello Herr Flick
Thank you for reading my post. Yes, I tried it also without these small spring. It is little bit better but still not enough to spin engine continuously. Clutch still work very nice only when decompression valve is open.
I tryied also another new pair of start shoes (Ferodo this time), still the same.
Yes, I also think better performace and friction can be made by more speed of clutch bell or more weight of shoes or rougher surface on clutch body.

But what confuses me, there are several videos on Youtube where guys with BIG DEPS and original vario clutch simply starts their Ciao by one slow push on pedal or pushing Ciao forward for only about 2-3m. And when tehy show their clutch and setup I can´t see anything diffirent from mine. So it should work also with my setup.
Really strange for me.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Ahoj Wime
Ano, toto je můj set.
Motor běží, už jsem ho nastartoval pomocí vrtačky na matici variátoru.
Mám problém se startovací spojkou, protože komprese způsobuje vysoký odpor startovací spojky.
Mohu roztočit motor kopnutím pedálu, když je dekompresní ventil otevřený. Ale ne, když je dekompresní ventil zavřený, startovací boty prokluzují.
Děkuji Wimovi za pomoc při hledání příčiny.
Ano, doufám, že si můj příspěvek přečte i někdo další a možná je tu někdo další, kdo provozuje 80cc motor s vario a podělí se se mnou o nastavení.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Hello Wim

Tested oposit ditection of start shoes and it is wrong. It works worse, there is absolutely no attempt of friction when turning the clutch.
Start shoes can move easily in clutch bell.

Do not know what can be wrong.

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Yes, clutch turns clockwise.
OK, will test it with start shoes in oposit direction.
Thank you Wim

[dino29Topic starterBerichten: 14]

Yes, I think start shoes are in correct direction. Same direction like in service guide.

[Gebruiker]

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