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Hello everyone, I hope it is okay that I write in english, just tell me otherwise and I will use google translate.
I drive a Ciao with the following setup:
- Carter filed to 13mm, and enlarged inlet window
- Original 50cc
- Dellorto 13/13 @66 nozzle
- Giannelli City Power
- Malossi Airfilter
- 105mm pulley
It runs at 50km/h and is very strong = It goes 50km/h both downhill and uphill.
Question: What pulley would you guys recomend for my setup? (70,80 or 95). And what speed do you think that pulley would give me with my current setup?
Cheers!
No problem to ask a question in English. Earlier we had even an English and German section on this site. But i assume these are gone with the migration to this new website.
Anyway, you might have a look at the following link: https://vespa-ciao.nl/how-tos/overige-how-tos/Calculate-your-topspeed/
I do think your pulley is indeed to large, how does it drive at topspeed? A lot of vibration due to high rpm’s?
As you describe it’s very potent also uphill. Change to a smaller pulley to get an higher top speed and keep your rpm in check. I guess a 80 pulley is fine for your setup and this will drive a lot smoother.The rpm/acceleration is indeed very high. I will try a 80mm pulley then. About speed, the only thing I am not sure about is the rpm with this current setup. The cylinder is getting a lot of fuel air mixture for being only 50cc.
A pulley and a matching belt are not expensive things, so I guess I could just buy them and try it out!
Thank you Martino!
according to this:
Cilinder: 38.2 mm met gevlakte kop
Carters: Snor
Carburateur: 12/10 met sproeier 45
Filter: Snora Gianelli Original Power would give 7140 rpm. But that setup is a bit weaker then mine. Hmm.. Any educated guess about my current maximum rpm?
The English and German section is still there @Martino 😉 But I guess people need it less and less with all the translation functions browsers offer these days.
@swebass, don’t hang to tightly on an exact number for your RPM. Just listening to the RPM, measuring your speed and feeling how a different pulley changes the power will be sufficient to determine the right pulley.Changing to a smaller pulley also doesn’t mean you will maintain the exact same RPM, changes are it will be a bit lower. However this can make the ride a bit more comfortable as Martino said.
And yes, English is just fine and a lot easier to read compared to the Dutch output of Google translate
Welkom op ons forum!
Breng een bezoekje aan mijn Ciao project.Thanks AA-T! I think I get what you are saying. And I will indeed try a smaller pulley. The reason I was curious about the rpm was because the link Martino gave me about how to calculate the top speed (in theory at least).
So used the formula backwards to calculate my rpm, which should be around 8300 rpm if I drive at 55km/h with my setup. This would give me a speed of about 80km/h with a 70mm pulley, in theory, according to the formula. But as you, AA-T point out. My rpm would be lower with a smaller pully, so in reality the speed will most probably be a lot lower than 80km/h. My guess is more like 65 km/h with a 70mm pulley using my setup.
Do you guys think that sounds reasonable? I am only asking since the Swedish p*lice is very very picky with mopeds and their speed xD xD
according to this:
Cilinder: 38.2 mm met gevlakte kop Carters: Snor Carburateur: 12/10 met sproeier 45 Filter: Snor a Gianelli Original Power would give 7140 rpm. But that setup is a bit weaker then mine. Hmm.. Any educated guess about my current maximum rpm?
Keep in mind the rpm is only the max rpm and depends on how long the user keeps up the run. Better have a look at the following graph hp vs rpm. And you will see there is no power at this 7000+ rpm. Best poweroutput around 4500rpm.
I think 65 might also be a bit on the high end, not impossible but getting pass 60 with an original cilinder is quite an achievement.. How do you measure your speed, the vespa speedometer or GPS? This can make a big difference.
What is your goal? Going as fast as possible or..? Since you’re asking because the police can be a pain in the ass.
Welkom op ons forum!
Breng een bezoekje aan mijn Ciao project.Martino, good point, I totally forgot about that!
AA-T. I measured with a GPS. 50km/h in slight uphill, 60km/h in steep downhill, and 54km/h on flat ground. I also did measure the old school way by distance and time, and got almost the same results.
My goal is just to have a smoother ride. ATM it is kinda fun to ride on small roads just because the acceleration is so aggressive, but I think the engine would be more happy in the long run with a little bit less acceleration.
I just ordered a Malossi pulley 80mm and a matching Malossi drive belt from JMPB. Along with some fresh Clutch shoes A-Quality Newfren and a set of Polini Springs. I will keep you posted about the results.
I am not sure about this, but this guy claims he got 69km/h out of a stock cylinder:
http://outofcontrolmopeds.blogspot.com/2009/12/super-stock-ciao.html?m=1
Interesting read nevertheless!
He did quite a bit of work on the cilinder, lifting it probably was the most effective adjustment. Some users on this forum have good experience doing so 🙂
The 80mm pulley will help you achive a smoother ride. Hopefully you get the parts soon so you can get your hands dirty.
Welkom op ons forum!
Breng een bezoekje aan mijn Ciao project.It was a long time ago when I drove a 50cc on the exact same setup. I always went for the 80mm pulley. I think it Wil do a good 60kmh.
If you want to go a bit further with you’re cilinder I would recommend that you mill the exhaust port 1.5mm wider and higher. Reason for that is that it can produce some more torque at higher rpm. The gianelly city power is capable of doing a solid 7k rpm with good bag of torque 🙂 I am now running more or less the same setup and get speeds of around 72kmh on a flat surface (50cc cilinder with 4 extra ports and modified exhaust port)De budget beun tjoener: geen geld is te duur of het werkt nog niet
Link naar Mijn collectie / Projecten.Ritze, thank you for interesting input. I am indeed interested in modifying the stock cylinder. Do you have any pictures or any documentation on how you created those 4 ports? Maybe there is any good forum thread you could recomend? When you say 1,5 mm wider and higher, what do you mean by higher? Do you mean grinding some extra towards the top of the cylinder? Sorry for a lot of questions, I am just curious and enjoy the small details when it comes to stock tuning!
Thanks in advance!
Hey,
In my opinion your nozzle is too big for your setup. I use a 58 nozzle on a Leovinci Circuit and Proma Circuit. How does your sparkplug colour lookalike?
To be honest, your pulley really depends on what you want. If you drive through a city they I would go for a 105mm or 94mm according to your setup. What kind of clutch springs do you use?
Kind Regards 😉
4-takt krijg de tering, ik rij meng-smering!
Check mijn perso!There is a link under my post, click on that and go to page 45 at the end of the page, is difficult to explain but port has to go up to the cilinder head and the extra ports where made by drilling a 5.5mm hole in de cilinder at a angle of around 10 to 11 degrees, you should practice on a worn out cilinder
De budget beun tjoener: geen geld is te duur of het werkt nog niet
Link naar Mijn collectie / Projecten.KillerNoway, thanks for the headsup. I bought nozzles from 60-72 to play around with, as soon as my package show up. Even tho I find the 66 to be giving good performance atm. I have no off sounds or weak spots in the acceleration. It just goes straight up to top speed and sounds perfect, with a good draw over the whole rpm registry. Colour of the spark is looking good, but I bought the nozzles because I wanted to see if it can be even better. At the end of the day I just enjoy to have a little bit more juice in the system than too little, to be on the safe side during this hot summer days. After some reading I find 64-68 being rather common with my setup.
I drive to Ciao out on the country side, so it is more about long roads at full speed then the start and stop driving required in a city environment.
At the moment the springs are probably the ones that came with the ciao from the store in the 90s. But I ordered new polini springs yesterday, the ones thst are not painted. I also ordered the Newfren clutch shoes.
Thanks!
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